RAP vs. ROCK: The Battle Of GatorAIDS

[Alfred]

WARNING: ABSOLUTELY NO "RAP IS CRAP" OR IGNORANT COMMENTS ABOUT HIP HOP NOT BEING "REAL MUSIC"

Every forum needs one of these. This is where we talk about which is the better genre, rock or hip hop.

I pick rock because I've known and loved the genre longer, I like more rock artists, and it's way broader of a genre than hip hop.

That said, hip hop is amazing if you don't listen to the stuff on MTV. It takes a lot of talent to produce quality hip hop, and there's some really good songwriting involved. I've been digging Aesop Rock and P.O.S. quite bit recently.

Edit: can a mod add a poll? no "other" option please

[Drew618]

ABSOLUTELY NO "RAP IS CRAP" OR IGNORANT COMMENTS ABOUT HIP HOP NOT BEING "REAL MUSIC"

rap is crap. hip hop is not "real music". :]

ANYWAYS, rock is by far better in my opinion.

[Dragonfire93]

Rock's better. Rap has just never appealed to me, unless there's a REALLY good beat. :cool:

[L4nd0]

i like both and i love when both collide
example : numb encore remix (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MxiOjVOdyAQ)

[John]

Rock's better. Rap has just never appealed to me, unless there's a REALLY good beat. :cool:
There are some actually decent rap, but those are from the 90s and the 80s, today.. 50 cetn and crank dat crap.

[Justin]

Rap's okay. But I prefer rock. I don't mind some of the old rap music but the new popular stuff sucks.

[LOL]

crank dat

'Nuff said.

[Ænima]

Rock rocks your socks!

The only rap band I can stand is Rage Against the Machine, and they're DECENT, nothing more.

[Kani]

Rock rocks your socks!

The only rap band I can stand is Rage Against the Machine, and they're DECENT, nothing more.

RATM are hardly a rap band, they're hard rock/rapcore.

And they're awesome :kirby101:


Anyway, I find rock much better than rap. I usually only listen to rap if it's mixed with some other kind of music, because just by itself it isn't very appealing.

Rock ftw.

[WANTED PENGUIN!]

i like both. there are some really good rap artists out there and some really crappy ones. there are some really good rock bands out there and there are crappy ones. i really prefer old rap compared to any of the new stuff. but i guess if i had to choose, i'd pick rock because i've listened to it the longest and i know a lot more rock musicians than rap ones.

[Mr. Torpedo]

Rock all the way. I can't stand rap except for some of the old school stuff.

[Alfred]

There are some actually decent rap, but those are from the 90s and the 80s, today.. 50 cetn and crank dat crap.

50 Cent hasn't been relevent in hip hop for years and no one listens to Crank Dat anymore. Listen to some Aesop Rock, P.O.S, even Lupe Fiasco. All great rappers.

[Drew618]

All great rappers.

Oxymoron spotted. :kirby101:

[Worldking01]

I like Nu-Metal the best.
(Metal[Much like rock], with rapping in it)

Oh and Bestie Boy's alone is good enough to make me vote rap.

[Rigs]

I enjoyed the rap that came on on the '80s radio channel today.

But other than that, I'm not a real fan. I usually like my music to be calmer, slow but not overly emotional (if the singer sounds pained when he's singing a song about a break-up, it comes off as very very annoying). Acoustic guitars and a soft, mellow voice is all I need.

So that probably falls under the category of rock?

[Clockwork]

If it weren't for idiots driving around blasting fucking Soulja Boy at max volume and max bass, I probably wouldn't mind rap as much as I do nowadays.

Rock all the way.

[Alfred]

Oxymoron spotted. :kirby101:

If you're not going to post an intellegent comment on why you think rap is so bad then gtfo.

[frezal]

Sampled 5-second "beats" looped for 3 minutes with a guy speaking in rhymes over the top doesn't constitute as music to me. You gotta play your own instruments and learn how to sing.

[Galacticboy7]

I believe I listen to rap more
It was better in previous ages

[Alfred]

Sampled 5-second "beats" looped for 3 minutes with a guy speaking in rhymes over the top doesn't constitute as music to me. You gotta play your own instruments and learn how to sing.

That's not even what rap is like... at all. They sample, yes (not all rappers sample, by the way), that's been part of hip hop for ages. One of the trickiest parts of hip hop is making the samples fit with the song. That's called production.

I'd also like to add that hip hop vocalists are just as talented as rock/pop/blues/everything else vocalists, and many do, in fact, sing. Let's see you write lyrics as witty or intelligent and then rap a whole verse of them without having to take a breath. Hip hop musicians are extremely talented, not that you'd know anything about talent.

listen to this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5emV4WTi-Y) song and shut up

[Ænima]

If it weren't for idiots driving around blasting fucking Soulja Boy at max volume and max bass, I probably wouldn't mind rap as much as I do nowadays.

Rock all the way.

I'm lucky the Soulja Boy-disease hasn't spread to Sweden yet:dog:

[frezal]

That's not even what rap is like... at all.
Are you telling me that they don't loop a short "beat" or sample "beats" from other songs?

They sample, yes (not all rappers sample, by the way), that's been part of hip hop for ages.
So it looks like your previous statement was an overdramatic reaction to someone calling out your beloved genre of noise.

One of the trickiest parts of hip hop is making the samples fit with the song. That's called production.
Real musicians have to write actual music in the background of their songs. In this actual music, they have to convey all sorts of emotion. Then, they have to write the lyrics, and figure out a way for them to harmonize with said music. Rappers wouldn't know anything about that.

I'd also like to add that hip hop vocalists are just as talented as rock/pop/blues/everything else vocalists, and many do, in fact, sing.
If they're rapping, then they're not singing. If they know how to sing, they should quit being lazy and drop the rapping. Singing requires a lot more talent than firing off rhymes.

Let's see you write lyrics as witty or intelligent and then rap a whole verse of them without having to take a breath. Hip hop musicians are extremely talented, not that you'd know anything about talent.
Let's see you improv a sax solo in E dorian. I'm not a lyricist, nor am I a poet, so expecting me to fire off some rap lyrics would be difficult. That doesn't prove that rap is music. Nailing 3 point shots is difficult, but that doesn't make basketball music.

listen to this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5emV4WTi-Y) song and shut up
That wasn't a song. That was a dude telling me his political opinions in a slightly rhythmic way.

Watch this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xRNlFAjpw48) and tell me that the rapper you mentioned is just as talented as these guys. Notice that they are playing everything live nearly 30 years after the song was written.

[Alfred]

Are you telling me that they don't loop a short "beat" or sample "beats" from other songs?
No, I'm saying you're wrong to say that rap is all just some guy talking over a 5 second loop. Rap is way more diverse than that.

So it looks like your previous statement was an overdramatic reaction to someone calling out your beloved genre of noise.
I hate how you make it sound like sampling is BAD. Why is it any better when a pop singer just gets some backing band. They aren't playing anything either, just singing.

Beloved genre of noise, huh? Aren't you the same guy who likes Metallica? Metallica is waaaaaay noisier than hip hop music.


Real musicians have to write actual music in the background of their songs. In this actual music, they have to convey all sorts of emotion. Then, they have to write the lyrics, and figure out a way for them to harmonize with said music. Rappers wouldn't know anything about that.
No they fucking don't. Just because you have this ignorant and close-minded view of what music is doesn't mean that rappers have no talent and they don't make music.

You say "Real Musicians" have to convey all sorts of emotion... Listen to Sage Francis, Tupac, if that's not emotion, I don't know what is.

You also talk about lyrics. You talk as though rappers don't write lyrics... what the hell? Rappers are some of the most talented lyricists alive, don't even try to deny that.

If they're rapping, then they're not singing. If they know how to sing, they should quit being lazy and drop the rapping. Singing requires a lot more talent than firing off rhymes.
You're so stubborn. Why should they drop the rapping? The purpose of rap music is to focus on rap. It's poetic and rhythmic speaking... the appeal is in the delivery of the message. They don't NEED to sing to make enjoyable music.


Let's see you improv a sax solo in E dorian. I'm not a lyricist, nor am I a poet, so expecting me to fire off some rap lyrics would be difficult. That doesn't prove that rap is music. Nailing 3 point shots is difficult, but that doesn't make basketball music.
This is a stupid anaylsis. I don't even know what you're trying to say. No basketball isn't music... what's your point?


That wasn't a song. That was a dude telling me his political opinions in a slightly rhythmic way.
I don't even think you listened to the full song. It WAS a song, there was composition, there was a beat, and just for you, P.O.S SANG.

Watch this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xRNlFAjpw48) and tell me that the rapper you mentioned is just as talented as these guys. Notice that they are playing everything live nearly 30 years after the song was written.
I'm a huge fan of Pink Floyd. The thing is, Pink Floyd are a BAND. A BAND. Rappers are individual people. No, rappers couldn't go into the studio and record some epic prog album but Pink Floyd couldn't go into the studio and write and record a rap record as witty, amusing, or enjoyable as POS could.

Basically you're just being close-minded, ignorant, and stubborn. If you don't like rap, fine. If you are gonna be an asshole and be like "Well it's not music because he doesn't play his instruments", then I'm not even going to argue with you. The fact is, you're wrong and you don't know anything about hip hop or what music is.

[frezal]

No, I'm saying you're wrong to say that rap is all just some guy talking over a 5 second loop. Rap is way more diverse than that.
There are always exceptions.


I hate how you make it sound like sampling is BAD. Why is it any better when a pop singer just gets some backing band. They aren't playing anything either, just singing.
When did I defend pop singers? It is of my belief that if you can't perform your own songs, you are not a real musician. That goes for all of the rock bands out there who cannot perform live (Dragonforce anyone?).

Beloved genre of noise, huh? Aren't you the same guy who likes Metallica? Metallica is waaaaaay noisier than hip hop music.
Metallica is very clearly music (noisy music, but music nonetheless). "Orion" is proof of that.

No they fucking don't. Just because you have this ignorant and close-minded view of what music is doesn't mean that rappers have no talent and they don't make music.
You're refusing to let me have my own opinion of rap, yet you call me close minded? You can think what you want about rap. I have no problem with that.

You say "Real Musicians" have to convey all sorts of emotion... Listen to Sage Francis, Tupac, if that's not emotion, I don't know what is.
You're taking what I said out of context. I was referring to the "instrumentals", not the vocals.

You also talk about lyrics. You talk as though rappers don't write lyrics... what the hell? Rappers are some of the most talented lyricists alive, don't even try to deny that.
Once again you struggle with reading comprehension. I was referring to the fact that they don't have to deal with harmonizing with what's going on behind them.

You're so stubborn.
Says the guy who's desperately trying to change my opinion on rap.

Why should they drop the rapping? The purpose of rap music is to focus on rap. It's poetic and rhythmic speaking... the appeal is in the delivery of the message. They don't NEED to sing to make enjoyable music.
Rhythmic speaking is not music. Singing, on the other hand, is a part of music.

This is a stupid anaylsis. I don't even know what you're trying to say. No basketball isn't music... what's your point?
Just because something is hard to do (ex. writing rap lyrics), that doesn't mean it's music.

I don't even think you listened to the full song. It WAS a song, there was composition, there was a beat, and just for you, P.O.S SANG.
I will give the man credit for trying to sing. If only he had worked on his vocals and sang the entire song.

I'm a huge fan of Pink Floyd.
Good. They were made out of talent.

The thing is, Pink Floyd are a BAND. A BAND. Rappers are individual people. No, rappers couldn't go into the studio and record some epic prog album but Pink Floyd couldn't go into the studio and write and record a rap record as witty, amusing, or enjoyable as POS could.
Why couldn't they go in there and produce a concept album? Trent Reznor's done it (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year_Zero_(album)). And while it wasn't a concept album, Serj Tankian's album consisted of him playing all of the instruments (aside from drums).

And no, the remaining members of Pink Floyd wouldn't be able to make a good rap album because Roger Waters or David Gilmour would actually sing. The wittyness would be there, though. Roger Waters happens to be an amazing lyricist.

Basically you're just being close-minded, ignorant, and stubborn.
Says the guy who's not open to the viewpoint that rap isn't music.

If you don't like rap, fine.
You don't feel that way. If you did, you wouldn't have challenged me.

If you are gonna be an asshole and be like "Well it's not music because he doesn't play his instruments", then I'm not even going to argue with you.
You already have, Alfie.

The fact is, you're wrong and you don't know anything about hip hop
Where did you learn that debate tactic, the playground? Please! You're talking to an intercollegiate debater here! You can't beat me using, "You're wrong because I'm right," tactics.

or what music is.
How much money did you earn playing music last year? I earned around $850. How many times have you played to a crowd of 30,000-65,000 people? Far fewer times than I have, bro.

[Alfred]

When did I defend pop singers? It is of my belief that if you can't perform your own songs, you are not a real musician. That goes for all of the rock bands out there who cannot perform live (Dragonforce anyone?).
What they recorded is still music, and hip hop musicians do perform their own songs. If you watch on live videos, they have DJs accompanying them, and of course their vocal performance is still performing, is it not?


Metallica is very clearly music (noisy music, but music nonetheless). "Orion" is proof of that.
Rap is very clearly music. It has a beat, it has composition, it's music.


You're refusing to let me have my own opinion of rap, yet you call me close minded? You can think what you want about rap. I have no problem with that.

I'm not refusing to let you have your own opinion on rap. You're free to dislike it. You can't have an opinion on the definition of music though, that's objective and something that is defined by the dictionary.

You're taking what I said out of context. I was referring to the "instrumentals", not the vocals.
Okay, rap has music in the background too, and it does effect the mood of the song. The song I showed you is a perfect example.

Once again you struggle with reading comprehension. I was referring to the fact that they don't have to deal with harmonizing with what's going on behind them.
Harmonizing, no, they rap. They can't just spit words out at any random time though. Like all music

Says the guy who's desperately trying to change my opinion on rap.
As I've said before, I couldn't give two shits about what you think of the genre. I just think it's incredibly stupid that you feel it isn't music.

Rhythmic speaking is not music. Singing, on the other hand, is a part of music.
Why is it not music?

Just because something is hard to do (ex. writing rap lyrics), that doesn't mean it's music.
Okay, I didn't understand what you were trying to say one little bit.

I will give the man credit for trying to sing. If only he had worked on his vocals and sang the entire song.
Trying to sing? POS is an great singer. He's subtle, but he has a great voice. Why would he sing throughout the song, this is rap music. The singing was there to add diversity to the music. It goes with what I said before, hip hop can be progressive like that.


Why couldn't they go in there and produce a concept album? Trent Reznor's done it (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year_Zero_(album)). And while it wasn't a concept album, Serj Tankian's album consisted of him playing all of the instruments (aside from drums).
These are rock musicians, and Trent Reznor is a well known solo artist and Serj Tankian has been in the often experimental System Of A Down. They're experienced with the more experimental side of rock.

And no, the remaining members of Pink Floyd wouldn't be able to make a good rap album because Roger Waters or David Gilmour would actually sing. The wittyness would be there, though. Roger Waters happens to be an amazing lyricist.
'
I hate how you can't seem to grasp the concept that rap music isn't about singing.

Says the guy who's not open to the viewpoint that rap isn't music.
Why would I be open to such a ridiculous thing?

Look:

music - "the science or art of ordering tones or sounds in succession, in combination, and in temporal relationships to produce a composition having unity and continuity"

I don't see one reason why rap doesn't fall into this category.

You don't feel that way. If you did, you wouldn't have challenged me.
Of course I feel this way. If you don't like this kind of music, that's up to you. When you go and say that it involves no talent and it's not music, then yes, I feel the need to argue against that.

Where did you learn that debate tactic, the playground? Please! You're talking to an intercollegiate debater here! You can't beat me using, "You're wrong because I'm right," tactics.
You fail to give factual evidence why rap isn't music, instead you just go around comparing it to rock and saying how Pink Floyd are so talented and that you need to play your own instruments to be considered music.

How much money did you earn playing music last year? I earned around $850. How many times have you played to a crowd of 30,000-65,000 people? Far fewer times than I have, bro.

What does this have anything to do with your knowledge of recorded music?

[frezal]

What they recorded is still music, and hip hop musicians do perform their own songs. If you watch on live videos, they have DJs accompanying them, and of course their vocal performance is still performing, is it not?
Are the DJs playing the parts live on a synthesizer or are they playing pre-recorded music from some turntables?

If a rapper has a live band performing the music, or even just a guy on a synth playing it all, then I'm willing to change my stance for that particular rapper.

Rap is very clearly music. It has a beat, it has composition, it's music.
What do you mean by "it has composition"? When I see the word compostion, I instantly think of stuff like this:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/41/Adeste_Fideles_sheet_music_sample.svg/685px-Adeste_Fideles_sheet_music_sample.svg.png

Can you read that, by the way (the notes, not the words)?

I'm not refusing to let you have your own opinion on rap. You're free to dislike it. You can't have an opinion on the definition of music though, that's objective and something that is defined by the dictionary.
Definitions are anything but set in stone. For instance, my dictionary has a different definition than yours.

"The art or science of combining vocal or instrumental sounds (or both) to produce beauty of form, harmony, and expression of emotion."

Whereas yet another dictionary says this:
"Any pleasing or interesting sounds."


Okay, rap has music in the background too, and it does effect the mood of the song. The song I showed you is a perfect example.
Throughout most of that song, the music was so far in the background that it had no effect.


Harmonizing, no, they rap. They can't just spit words out at any random time though. Like all music
According to the first definition I posted, harmony is required for music.


As I've said before, I couldn't give two shits about what you think of the genre. I just think it's incredibly stupid that you feel it isn't music.
You contradicted yourself there. Consider revising.

Why is it not music?
If there were real music in the background of most rap, I would begin to respect the genre. Until then, I will continue to consider it a pseudo-genre.


Trying to sing? POS is an great singer. He's subtle, but he has a great voice.
I think we're going to have to disagree on this one, as we obviously have very different definitions of "great".

Why would he sing throughout the song, this is rap music. The singing was there to add diversity to the music. It goes with what I said before, hip hop can be progressive like that.
Singing is progressive? Perhaps somebody should have told Pink Floyd about that. They could have saved a lot of effort.

These are rock musicians, and Trent Reznor is a well known solo artist
Yet he can come up with a concept album.

and Serj Tankian has been in the often experimental System Of A Down. They're experienced with the more experimental side of rock.
And he was able to find the time to lay down all of the instrumental tracks. According to Wikipedia, POS was involved with punk music before switching to hip hop. What's his excuse for not being able do his own backgrounds? If he does do them, I may have to change my mind about this particular dude.


I hate how you can't seem to grasp the concept that rap music isn't about singing.
Generally, vocals in music are sung.

Why would I be open to such a ridiculous thing?
If you were as open minded as you want me to be, you would be open to my POV.

Look:

music - "the science or art of ordering tones or sounds in succession, in combination, and in temporal relationships to produce a composition having unity and continuity"

I don't see one reason why rap doesn't fall into this category.
As I have already shown, there is no one definition for music.


Of course I feel this way. If you don't like this kind of music, that's up to you. When you go and say that it involves no talent and it's not music, then yes, I feel the need to argue against that.
It require very little musical talent. Does rap require knowledge of chord progressions? Does rap require knowledge of harmonies? From what I can see, rap really only requires the ability to stay on beat. I would include the ability to write good lyrics, but I don't think good lyrics are required for a good song.

You fail to give factual evidence why rap isn't music, instead you just go around comparing it to rock and saying how Pink Floyd are so talented and that you need to play your own instruments to be considered music.
And you have really provided no "factual" evidence to support your claim that rap is music. You brought up the fact that rap has beats and "compositions", but you have yet to explain what you mean by that or why that matters.

What does this have anything to do with your knowledge of recorded music?
You said that I have no knowledge of what music is, yet I probably have a lot more experience with music than you.

I think I might ask my good friend who is majoring in music at the University of Washington about this.

[Alfred]

I'm not even going to bother picking apart your post again. You're clearly set in your ways and you misinterpret many things I say.

You're way too much of a purist and I really think you should broaden your horizons instead of just listening to the same mainstream classic rock/metal or whatever it is you listen to. I'm sure hip hop isn't the only genre you wouldn't consider music.

how about this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1zWZ7jl_pg

And I wish you'd stop trying to make yourself look so credible. I don't give a shit if you supposedly played in front of thousands of people... however, I would be curious to know what your friend says. Maybe he doesn't let his bias get in the way of his arguing.

one last thing

And you have really provided no "factual" evidence to support your claim that rap is music. You brought up the fact that rap has beats and "compositions", but you have yet to explain what you mean by that or why that matters.
It seems that the only thing holding you back from admitting that rap is music is that many rap musicians don't play their instruments.

Do you consider this music?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnevMn60Unk

[frezal]

I do consider The Roots to be musicians. In fact, I'm quite fond of the drummer's style.

[Alfred]

So you agree that that is a song and it is music?

[frezal]

So you agree that that is a song and it is music?
I didn't listen to it, but they usually produce music.

I've been speaking in generalities. Rarely do I believe in absolutes.

[Cammayyistammika]

Rock all the way. But however, I personally like both.

[ashendrakar]

i hate most rap, although i have heard a few good songs

i vote rock

[Alfred]

I didn't listen to it, but they usually produce music.

I've been speaking in generalities. Rarely do I believe in absolutes.

Well picture this... the song is exactly the same, but the music is sampled. Is it still music?

[frezal]

Well picture this... the song is exactly the same, but the music is sampled. Is it still music?
I guess it would depend. Did the artist originally record the sampled music? Can the artist, if necessary, perform the sampled portions live?

[Alfred]

That's not the point, is the combination of sounds music or not?

[Ænima]

Even though I'm a rocker and dislike rap, I gotta agree with Alfred here, rap IS music, even though I don't like it.

[frezal]

That's not the point, is the combination of sounds music or not?
Is the sound of a toilet flushing mixed with a baby crying music to you?

[Alfred]

Is the sound of a toilet flushing mixed with a baby crying music to you?

Is that what The Roots sound like to you?

Answer my question dammit, what if it's sampled music that they didn't originally record yet sounds the same as the song I posted? Is it or is it not still music?

[frezal]

Is that what The Roots sound like to you?
No. Here is what you said:
[...]is the combination of sounds music or not?
Do you hold the position that the combination of any sounds constitutes as music? I do not consider music to be just the combination of sounds.

Answer my question dammit, what if it's sampled music that they didn't originally record yet sounds the same as the song I posted? Is it or is it not still music?
I have already stated my position on sampling (or at the very least implied my position).

[Butters]

I can summarize rap:
*Bleep* *bleep*money*Bleep*bitches*Bleep*White cops*Bleep*Racist*Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Blee p**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep*
*Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep** Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep*'
*Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep*Word*Bleep*

[The Chandrunator]

I can summarize rap:
*Bleep* *bleep*money*Bleep*bitches*Bleep*White cops*Bleep*Racist*Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Blee p**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep*
*Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep** Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep*'
*Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep*Word*Bleep*
Well said.

[frezal]

I can summarize rap:
*Bleep* *bleep*money*Bleep*bitches*Bleep*White cops*Bleep*Racist*Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Blee p**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep*
*Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep** Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep*'
*Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep*Word*Bleep*
Uh oh! Alf is going to chew you out for that one.

[Alfred]

Do you hold the position that the combination of any sounds constitutes as music? I do not consider music to be just the combination of sounds.
I was talking about a specific combination of sounds, the music of the Roots.


I have already stated my position on sampling (or at the very least implied my position).
I still think it's incredibly foolish to say that X isn't music because of the recording methods. You're hereby dismissing not only rap, but a large amount of electronic music.

I can summarize rap:
*Bleep* *bleep*money*Bleep*bitches*Bleep*White cops*Bleep*Racist*Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Blee p**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep*
*Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep** Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep*'
*Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep**Bleep*Word*Bleep*
I see you're educated on the hip hop genre... would you care to find me an example of a rap song like this?

[frezal]

I still think it's incredibly foolish to say that X isn't music because of the recording methods. You're hereby dismissing not only rap, but a large amount of electronic music.
I'm also dismissing quite a bit of rock and pop "music".

[Alfred]

So let me get this straight, these recorded songs, things that are defined by every single dictionary out there (no matter what definition they give) as pieces of music somehow lose all of their defining traits because of how they are recorded and whether or not they can be performed live?

I'm not kidding here, that is the stupidest fucking thing I have ever heard.

[frezal]

So let me get this straight, these recorded songs, things that are defined by every single dictionary out there (no matter what definition they give) as pieces of music somehow lose all of their defining traits because of how they are recorded and whether or not they can be performed live?

I'm not kidding here, that is the stupidest fucking thing I have ever heard.
Which dictionaries specify these specific recordings as being music? I have yet to read a dictionary definition that even mentions sampling.

P.S.
You realize that I'm just trolling you, right?

[Alfred]

Which dictionaries specify these specific recordings as being music? I have yet to read a dictionary definition that even mentions sampling.

They don't need to talk about sampling because they're not stupid and don't care about how the music is recorded, just that it IS recorded and it fits their definition of music.


P.S.
You realize that I'm just trolling you, right?

Okay man, whatever you say.

[frezal]

I was really hoping you'd bring this up, so instead I'll make the point for you. What about when rock bands include a bit of rapping into their songs? Does it cease to be music?

Example:

cqW4QFGBDkY

[Alfred]

Why don't you ask yourself that question, see I'm not the one arguing that rap isn't music. That is most definitely music, whether the song is performed by Rush or POS.

[frezal]

Why don't you ask yourself that question, see I'm not the one arguing that rap isn't music. That is most definitely music, whether the song is performed by Rush or POS.
You're taking this whole thing way too seriously. Read the first sentence of your first post in this thread and you will see why I argued the point I argued.

P.S.
RAP IS CRAP

[Walnut]

I'm partial to both sides of the track.

[Alfred]

You're taking this whole thing way too seriously. Read the first sentence of your first post in this thread and you will see why I argued the point I argued.

You argued that rap isn't music to be a troll?

[Rigs]

Alfred, I troll teenage girls on IMDB (mainly by attacking Twilight) all the time.

Moral of the story: Trolling is FUN.

[frezal]

You argued that rap isn't music to be a troll?
Yeah. It's the internet.

[Alfred]

Yeah. It's the internet.

In my experiance, trolls don't try to start debates.

You didn't waste my time at all. I'm here to debate, and I just assumed you were merely a stupid classic rock fanboy.

[frezal]

In my experiance, trolls don't try to start debates.

You didn't waste my time at all. I'm here to debate, and I just assumed you were merely a stupid classic rock fanboy.
I have an issue with people starting new threads by prohibiting certain viewpoints. When I read your first sentence (which is all I read of that post), I knew it was time to aggravate you. Since you were so against opposing viewpoints, I knew this would aggravate you the most. By the responses you gave, I'm fairly certain I was right.

[Alfred]

I said that because I didn't want a bunch of AC/DC-loving classic rock fanboy assholes to come into this thread like "rap ain't music ROCK FOR LIFE". The point of this thread is not whether it's music or not anyways, it's whether you prefer to listen to RAP or ROCK.

[Tolni]

Before I liked rap, but not and now. I like rock, which doesn`t mean that I listen and quote like some people do. I am more like in the between.